Cycling question

[Jamilw1989]

hey gerwin i am trying to cycle my tank by going through the differnt levels of fish and i have gone one step up the totum poll but the step two fish died the second they hit the water and i put stuff in there to knock out ammonia and it only makes it worse. I put goldfish in because i knew they were cheap fish and at the bottom of the food chain i had them in for a month then i took them out changed a few gallons of water and brought the ammonia down a little (I cant get it to go to zero) then i put platies in. while the platies were in there i put in some ammonia removing carbin into the filter to get it to clean it out and it only go worse and i lost the platies. i have done water changes every day 5 to 6 gallons a day and its still not coming down. I test the water right when it comes out of our tap and its amonia free and then when i put it in the tank and test the tank its through the roof. i dont get it. nothing is making any since anymore i mean my 20 gallon perfect my 5 gallon perfect my 10 gallon perfect my 55 I am lost.

[Dawgfan]

How is your nitrite and nitrate levels? What should happen when cycling a new freshwater tank, and you guys correct me if I'm wrong here, is that initially the ammonia level will begin to rise. When the ammonia level rises, nitrites will then begin to rise, processing the ammonia, followed by nitrates that process the nitrites. In my experience goldfish are one of the "dirtiest" fish, and is probably the reason for the high ammonia levels... It's also possible that there is a large amount of uneaten food built up in the substrate that will have to be processed.

How long has the tank been setup? When I cycle a tank I do not actually use sacrificial fish. Also, when I first got into the hobby, I found myself chasing ammonia levels with ammonia remedies.

Here is what I would do. You said you had a few other setups that were doing ok. I'd vacuum the substrate real good, do a 50 percent or more water change, and inspect for any organic materials hidden in the aquarium. Fill the tank back up, and use some of the filter medium out of one of your other tanks in the filter of your 55. Don't add any fish. Let it cycle, test the water daily and look for the nitrite and nitrate spikes. Then add fish when the cycle is complete. I will usually have an aquarium setup for 6 weeks or more before I add any livestock.

Hope this helps.

[Jamilw1989]

How is your nitrite and nitrate levels? What should happen when cycling a new freshwater tank, and you guys correct me if I'm wrong here, is that initially the ammonia level will begin to rise. When the ammonia level rises, nitrites will then begin to rise, processing the ammonia, followed by nitrates that process the nitrites. In my experience goldfish are one of the "dirtiest" fish, and is probably the reason for the high ammonia levels... It's also possible that there is a large amount of uneaten food built up in the substrate that will have to be processed.

How long has the tank been setup? When I cycle a tank I do not actually use sacrificial fish. Also, when I first got into the hobby, I found myself chasing ammonia levels with ammonia remedies.

Here is what I would do. You said you had a few other setups that were doing ok. I'd vacuum the substrate real good, do a 50 percent or more water change, and inspect for any organic materials hidden in the aquarium. Fill the tank back up, and use some of the filter medium out of one of your other tanks in the filter of your 55. Don't add any fish. Let it cycle, test the water daily and look for the nitrite and nitrate spikes. Then add fish when the cycle is complete. I will usually have an aquarium setup for 6 weeks or more before I add any livestock.

Hope this helps.

ammonia is 8.0 nitrates and nitrites are zero. I know goldfish are dirty fish but i also know they are as lower as you can go in the totum poll of fish and i thought they might help start the bacteria process. I guess i was wrong. i have done all those steps that you suggested before and it worked for a while then it blew up in my face. i never had these problems cycling my other tanks they all started up great! the problems came later down the road like a year later then all the bottoms started to fall out of my perfectly running tanks now they are running great again and i am just gonna leave them alone other then the monthly filter change. and occasional water fill up. i just had to restart my ten gallon again because the ammonia spiked and everything got sick nothing died just got sick. but here is what pisses me off. i took the tank all the way down my dad helped me tear it down completely and scrub it out we refilled it cleaned everything installed a new filter and put tap water conditioner in there let it set for 24 hours to get water warmed up then i bought some fruit tetras and put them in and they are doing great
if it works for my 10 gallon what is wrong with my 55?

[Doug]

"Seeding" a new tank with biologically established media from another (healthy) tank is a good way to shorten the cycle time. But without a food source, the bacteria in that media will diminish and die off. The bacteria responsible for the nitrogen cycle need an energy source in the form of fish waste. Even without seeded media, the two bacteria are naturally present in the environment, and will multiply given a food source and time. The first one uses ammonia as its food source, and gives off nitrites as waste. The second uses nitrites as its energy source, and gives off nitrates as waste. NitrIte is still nearly as toxic as ammonia; nitrAtes are on the order of about 20x less toxic. Partial water changes are then done to regularly dilute the nitrates so they don't build up to levels that would be harmful to the animals.

Hardy fish that are ammonia and nitrite tolerant are used to get the bacteria established. Goldfish may be tolerant, but they are also cold water fish; putting them in a tropical temperature tank causes them to use more oxygen, and produce perhaps higher levels of ammonia than you really need to cycle the tank. A handful of mollies, platies, or zebras would be a better choice in a tropical tank. On average, a tank cycled without seeded media will take 4-6 weeks to complete the process. If you tested every day (not that you need to), you would observe ammonia rising steadily over the first few weeks. During that time you would also expect to see nitrites rise (and ammonia drop), as the first of the two bacteria multiply to the point they can efficiently convert the ammonia. At some point, you would begin to see low levels of nitrates, as the second bacteria establishes. Finally, you would observe nitrites drop off suddenly, sharply and totally, as the second type of bacteria doubles in numbers enough times to convert all the nitrites available to nitrate. It is at this point you would begin gradually adding "good" fish, and removing your tank-cycling hardy fish should you choose not to keep them.

I may be telling you something you already know here, but maybe I'm also telling you something you may have missed.

[Dawgfan]

Wow, that is really high ammonia. I'm not sure that I wouldn't simply start over. I am curious why your nitrite sand nitrates remain at zero...

[Jamilw1989]

the amonia is just so high i dont know how anything could live in there. i put some ammonia removing carbin into the filter and all that did was make it worse, a lot worse but i took as much of it out as i could and the tank is starting to look clear again but the amonia is still really high. if i took one of the filters pads out of one of our other tanks and installed it into the filter would that help the bacteria to grow faster.

[Jamilw1989]

i started the tank out as cold water and used the goldfish for 5 weeks then i took them out and cleaned some water out and warmed up the tank and then i tried to start with sunset platies and they didnt make it. and the amonia just wont come down.

[Jamilw1989]

I am done its over i give up completely. i am just screwed when it comes to this tank. i am just gonna put some fake fish and there and make it look good i dont give a crap anymore.

[Sandy]

Don't give up yet Jamie. Just let it run and push back for a day or two. We all go through days like this, we just have to push back and chill for a day or two to get a new outlook. Hang in there.

[Jamilw1989]

it just doesnt make since my 10 gallon crashed and burned the amonia was so high and G told me to clean my tank that was mostly likely the prob so i did and it didnt help it got worse so i had to move all the fish and take it down when i took it down I saw the prob. immediately he was right it was poop and food but i could not get to it with the siphon it was trapped under the UG filter and would not such up through the siphon i have no clue why. so i had my dad clean it out we brought it back in scrubbed everything and refilled it. I put in API tap water conditioner that i can get at G's and let it sit for 24 hours to warm back up and i installed a aqueon quite flow filter so it would have more filteration other then the UG and then i went to walmart the very next day and bought fruit tetras and put them in and they are fine. every fish in that tank is doing fantastic no sickness nothing. they eat every bit of food i give them and life is all good. Why isnt my 55g working? Im screwed!!!